Quora网友:华为Mate 60是否意味美国对华科技制裁的失败_风闻

最近，华为成功推出了搭载自研芯片的Mate 60系列手机，引起了国内外广泛关注并取得了巨大成功。这一成就引发了国际上关于美国对华半导体遏制失效的各种观点，这使得美国坐不住了！据了解，最近在白宫的简报会上，有记者询问了沙利文对于华为最新手机取得突破性进展的看法，以及是否证明了美国的出口管制失效。沙利文回应称：“无论如何，美国应继续实施‘小院高墙’技术限制措施。”在美版知乎Quora上，美国网友提问道：搭载5G麒麟9000s处理器的华为Mate 60 Pro的推出是否意味着美国对华贸易战和技术制裁的失败？这引起国际网友的围观，我们看看他们的观点。

新加坡网友Yes Tjiu的回答

Huawei has released a new mobile phone.

华为发布了一款新手机。

Yes, except for satellite calls, this phone is not much different from the latest iPhone or Samsung Galaxy.

是的，除了卫星通话，这款手机与最新的iPhone或三星Galaxy没有太大区别。

This is just a phone, it’s not a hydrogen bomb, it’s not nuclear fusion technology, it’s not even a Mars landing.

这只是一部手机，不是氢弹爆炸，也不是核聚变技术，甚至不是实现火星着陆。

Why can a mobile phone attract great attention?

为什么一部手机能引起巨大的关注？

This is because the emergence of this phone represents the end of the old era and the beginning of a new era.

这是因为这款手机的出现代表着旧时代的结束和新时代的开始。

The power of the United States is so strong that all countries/companies in the world must obey it.

美国的力量如此强大，世界上所有国家/企业都必须服从它。

When Americans say, “Hey, you can’t deal with this company, he’s evil!” All companies have no choice but to obey. Because even if they are not American companies, their government cannot protect them. Therefore, prior to this, no country or company could withstand the sanctions imposed by the United States.

当美国人说：“嘿。你不能和这家公司打交道，他是邪恶的！”所有的公司都没有办法只能服从。因为即使他们不是美国公司，他们的政府也无法保护他们。因此，在此之前，没有任何国家或公司能够承受美国的制裁。

In the past, a civilian enterprise subject to comprehensive sanctions from the United States could only go bankrupt, cease operations, be acquired, or shrink into a closed field to survive.

在过去，一个受到美国全面制裁的民用企业只能破产、停止运营、被收购，或者收缩到封闭的领域中生存。

At beginning, everyone believed that Huawei was the same. Without the support of American technology and global supply chains, this company would suffocate to death.

起初，所有人都认为华为是一样的。如果没有美国技术和全球供应链的支持，这家企业将窒息而死。

However, the emergence of this phone has overturned everything.

然而，这款手机的出现颠覆了一切。

It proves at least four key pieces of information:

它证明了至少四条关键信息：

1. The Chinese government has become so powerful that it is no longer afraid of the United States and has sufficient power to protect its own company. Chinese netizens have even mocked Raymond as a spokesperson for Huawei;

1.中国已经变得如此强大，以至于它不再怕美国，并且有足够的实力来保护自己的公司，中国网民甚至恶搞雷蒙多，说她是华为的发言人；

2. American technology is not unique, Chinese people can do it with just a little time. Even the most complex semiconductor industry can achieve this, but other industries can also do so.

2.美国的技术不是独一无二的，中国人只要花点时间就能做到。连最复杂的半导体行业都可以做到这一点，当然其他行业也可以。

3. China has established a complete semiconductor technology and industry chain, and their country can stand shoulder to shoulder with the world; They sent a clear signal: cooperation, welcome; Fight, give it a try.

3.中国已经建立了完整的半导体技术和产业链，他们的国家可以与世界肩并肩；他们发出了一个明确的信号：合作，欢迎；对抗，来试试。

4. The Chinese market is huge. In extreme cases, they do not need global trade, they are sufficient to sustain world-class enterprises.

4.中国市场巨大。在极端情况下，他们不需要全球贸易，他们足以维持世界级的企业。

If you don’t give me your market, you will also lose my market.

如果你不给我你的市场，你也会失去我的市场。

In short, the emergence of this phone sends a signal to all other countries in the world: when you feel that you don’t like or are oppressed by the United States, we will give you a second choice.

简而言之，这款手机的出现向世界上所有其他国家发出了一个信号：当你觉得自己不喜欢美国或被美国压迫时，我们会给你第二选择。

Therefore, it is not just a mobile phone, but a historic milestone.

因此，它不仅仅是一部手机，而是一个历史性的里程碑。

海外网友乌沙•潘迪的回答

Huawei was once the world’s largest smartphone supplier, with shipments exceeding 200 million units in 2018.

华为曾是全球最大的智能手机供应商，2018年出货量超过2亿部。

Last year, under the strict embargo imposed by the United States, its shipment volume was 28 million, more than eight times lower than its peak, and its market share has been eroded by Apple, Samsung, and other Chinese brands.

去年，在美国严厉的禁运下，它的出货量为2800万，比峰值减少了八倍多，市场份额已经被苹果、三星和其他中国品牌蚕食。

Especially for Apple, the sales of iPhones in Greater China have now surpassed those in the United States, all thanks to the low tide of Huawei’s high-end brands.

尤其是苹果，现在在大中华区的iPhone销量超过了美国本土，这一切都要归功于华为高端品牌的低潮。

How bad were the restrictions on Huawei at that time? The mobile phone assembler froze the assembly line overnight, refused to fulfill contractual obligations, cancelled the components on the order, withdrew Google’s Android license, and tore up the design license agreement.

当时对华为的限制有多糟糕？手机组装商一夜之间冻结了装配线，拒绝履行合同义务，订单上的组件被取消，谷歌撤回了安卓许可，设计许可协议被撕毁。

Huawei does not have an operating system, the hardware supply chain is completely disrupted, and lacks a highly specialized software design tool. Its chief financial officer is under house arrest in Canada.

华为没有操作系统，硬件供应链完全中断，缺乏一套高度专业化的软件设计工具，其首席财务官在加拿大被软禁。

If Huawei announces its exit from the consumer equipment industry, no one will be surprised.

如果华为宣布退出消费设备领域，任何人都不会感到惊讶。

Surprisingly, 5G telecommunications champion Huawei sold its subsidiary brand Honor and released 4G phones under the Huawei brand, enduring a heartbreaking decline in revenue. It conducted an internal review of the entire supply chain, from core telecommunications equipment business to consumer equipment, and embarked on a painful and expensive task of de Americanization. Any component with US intellectual property rights is marked as a domestic substitute. The process of its telecommunications equipment was completed earlier, but the equipment lacks two parts - a GPU for artificial intelligence gestures, payments, and cameras, and a 5G modem, which is protected by Qualcomm’s huge patent wall.

令人惊讶的是，5G电信冠军华为出售了其子品牌Honor，并以华为品牌发行了4G手机，经受住了令人心碎的收入下降。它对从核心电信设备业务到消费设备的整个供应链进行了内部审查，并开始了痛苦而昂贵的去美国化任务。任何带有美国知识产权的部件都被标记为国产替代品。其电信设备的这一过程早些时候已经完成，但设备方面缺少两部分——一个用于人工智能手势、支付和摄像头的GPU，以及一个5G调制解调器，后者受到高通公司巨大专利墙的保护。

Huawei discovered a vulnerability in EDA restrictions and designed its own GPU. It also introduces new transistor geometries to improve the performance of 7nm to 5nm nodes. It quickly upgraded its internal Hongmeng operating system to 4.0, making it a platform with big language artificial intelligence and IoT capabilities. Its software ecosystem is progressing smoothly, and the platform far exceeds the market share required to ensure survival.

华为发现了EDA限制的漏洞，并设计了自己的GPU。它还引入了新的晶体管几何形状，以提高7nm到5nm节点的性能。它迅速将其内部的鸿蒙操作系统升级到4.0，使其成为一个具有大语言人工智能和物联网能力的平台。它的软件生态系统进展顺利，该平台远远超出了确保生存所需的市场份额。

Adding to the icing on the cake, Huawei’s 2023 flagship phone Mate 60 series can conduct satellite calls, showcasing the maturity of its space communication technology and the bandwidth/coverage range of China’s commercial satellite network.

锦上添花的是，华为2023年的旗舰手机mate 60系列可以进行卫星通话，展示了其太空通信技术的成熟度和中国商业卫星网络的带宽/覆盖范围。

In on-site testing conducted by Hong Kong users, the Mate 60 Pro matched the 5G network speed of the iPhone 14, indicating that Huawei’s 5G modem matched Qualcomm’s implementation. For the first effort, this is a milestone.

在香港用户进行的现场测试中，Mate 60 Pro与iPhone 14的5G网络速度相匹配，表明华为的5G调制解调器与高通的实施相匹配。对于第一次努力来说，这是一个里程碑。

Huawei does not require GPS, Qualcomm’s 5G, LG’s OLED, Samsung’s storage, Micron’s storage, or even upstream chip design tools that are easily subject to US sanctions. In fact, even if we acquire top-notch features from Apple, Google, and Samsung and turn them into an imaginary hybrid champion, the Mate 60 Pro can still fight side by side because it has some industry-leading or performance leading features. It truly deserves the flagship title of 2023 and has won fair and just treatment.

华为不需要GPS、高通的5G、LG的OLED、三星的存储、美光的存储器，甚至不需要容易受到美国制裁的上游芯片设计工具。事实上，即使我们从苹果、谷歌和三星那里获得了一流的功能，并将其打造成一个假想的混合动力冠军，Mate 60 Pro仍然可以并肩作战，因为它具有一些行业领先或性能领先的功能。它确实配得上2023年的旗舰称号，赢得了公平公正的待遇。

Huawei achieved all of this in less than 4 years, which is a significant transformation, although it became the first target that the US government failed to destroy, possibly the first in history.

华为在不到4年的时间里完成了所有这些，这是一个显著的转变，尽管它成为了美国政府第一个未能摧毁的目标，可能是历史性的第一家。

德国网友雷•科莫的回答

In recent years, the behavior of the United States has been like a panicked clown, afraid of his opponents surpassing him. Putting politics above business poses a greater threat.

对美国近年来的行为就像一个惊慌失措的小丑，害怕对手超过他。让政治凌驾于商业之上会造成更大的威胁。

The current US leadership has lost its decision-making ability during the Cold War. They always want to take what they think is the fastest way to defeat their opponents. The series of actions taken by the United States since the end of the Cold War have completely shattered its own values. If you carefully read a series of American foreign propaganda terms such as free market, democracy and human rights, international order, etc., you will find that the United States itself is a bastard who recklessly destroys order.

目前的美国领导层已经失去了冷战时期的决策能力。他们总是想采取他们认为最快的方式来击败对手。美国自冷战结束以来的一系列行动彻底粉碎了其自身的价值观。如果你仔细阅读自由市场、民主人权、国际秩序等一系列美国对外宣传用语，你会发现美国本身就是肆意破坏秩序的混蛋。

Blocking China is the most interesting strategy I have ever heard of.

封锁中国是我听过的最有趣的策略。

Bill Gates should talk to the US President about how he allowed Windows and its piracy to conquer the Chinese market, and then let China’s own operating system die.

比尔·盖茨应该和美国总统谈谈他是如何让Windows和它的盗版征服中国市场，然后让中国自己的操作系统胎死腹中的。

海外网友安雅•沙文的回答

The launch of the Huawei Mate 60 Pro, equipped with a 5G Kirin 9000s processor, is a significant development as it demonstrates Huawei’s ability to develop and manufacture high-end smartphones despite US sanctions. However, it is still too early to say whether this means the United States has failed in the trade war with China.

搭载5G麒麟9000s处理器的华为Mate 60 Pro的推出是一个重大进展，因为它表明，尽管受到美国制裁，华为仍有能力开发和制造高端智能手机。然而，现在说这是否意味着美国在对华贸易战中的失败还为时过早。

The sanctions imposed by the United States have made it difficult for Huawei to obtain the components needed to manufacture its products. The Kirin 9000s processor is manufactured by Chinese semiconductor company SMIC International, which is not subject to US sanctions. However, SMIC is not as advanced as Taiwan Semiconductor Company TSMC, which once produced the Kirin 9000 processor. This means that the functionality of the Kirin 9000s processor is not as good as that of the Kirin 9000 processor.

美国的制裁使华为很难获得制造产品所需的组件。麒麟9000s处理器由中国半导体公司中芯国际制造，该公司不受美国制裁。然而，中芯国际没有台湾半导体公司台积电那么先进，台积电曾生产麒麟9000处理器。这意味着麒麟9000s处理器的功能不如麒麟9000处理器。

In addition, US sanctions have also made it difficult for Huawei to access Google’s Android operating system. Huawei has developed its own operating system, HarmonyOS, but it is not as popular as Android. This means that Huawei’s market share is being taken away by other smartphone manufacturers such as Samsung and Apple.

此外，美国的制裁也使华为难以访问谷歌的安卓操作系统。华为开发了自己的操作系统HarmonyOS，但它没有安卓那么受欢迎。这意味着华为的市场份额正在被三星和苹果等其他智能手机制造商夺走。

Overall, the launch of Huawei Mate 60 Pro is a positive development for Huawei. However, it is still too early to say whether this means the United States has failed in the trade war with China. The US sanctions still have a significant impact on Huawei, and it remains to be seen whether Huawei can overcome these challenges.

总的来说，华为Mate 60 Pro的推出对华为来说是一个积极的发展。然而，现在说这是否意味着美国在对华贸易战中的失败还为时过早。美国的制裁仍然对华为产生重大影响，华为是否能够克服这些挑战还有待观察。

Here are some additional points to consider:

以下是一些需要考虑的额外要点：

US sanctions are not the only factor affecting Huawei’s business. The company is also affected by a global chip shortage.

•美国的制裁并不是影响华为业务的唯一因素。该公司还受到全球芯片短缺的影响。

Huawei remains a major player in the smartphone market, but its market share has declined in recent years. The company also faces increasingly fierce competition from Chinese competitors such as Xiaomi and OPPO.

•华为仍然是智能手机市场的主要参与者，但近年来其市场份额有所下降。该公司还面临着来自小米和OPPO等中国竞争对手日益激烈的竞争。

The US sanctions may have a long-term impact on Huawei’s business. The company may need to find new ways to find components and develop its own operating system. Huawei may also be forced to exit certain markets, such as the United States.

•美国的制裁可能会对华为的业务产生长期影响。该公司可能需要找到新的方法来寻找组件并开发自己的操作系统。华为也有可能被迫退出某些市场，比如美国。

Only time can prove whether Huawei can overcome the challenges posed by US sanctions. However, the launch of Huawei Mate 60 Pro indicates that the company is still determined to compete in the global smartphone market.

只有时间才能证明华为是否能够克服美国制裁带来的挑战。然而，华为Mate 60 Pro的推出表明，该公司仍决心在全球智能手机市场竞争。

中国网友Jay Lee的回答

That’s why the United States is panicked because China is a competitor that the United States has never seen before.

这就是为什么美国感到恐慌，因为中国是美国从未见过的竞争对手。

Unlike countries like India, China has the ability and determination to move forward;

不像印度这样的国家，中国有能力和决心前进；

On the other hand, unlike EU countries and countries such as Japan, China has a huge internal market to protect its companies from sanctions.

另一方面，与欧盟国家和日本等国不同，中国有一个巨大的内部市场来保护其公司免受制裁。

In a test video on the technology blogger, they confirmed that the Mate 60 Pro is powered by the new Kirin 9000S produced in Chinese Mainland in the 35th week of 2020.

在科技博主上的一段测试视频中，他们证实Mate 60 Pro由2020年第35周在中国大陆生产的新款麒麟9000S提供动力。

But the CPU is not the protagonist of the Mate 60 Pro, as the Kirin 9000S is on par with the top performing Snapdragon 888 two years ago.

但CPU并不是Mate 60 Pro的主角，因为麒麟9000S与两年前的顶级性能骁龙888不相上下。

It is a BAW filter, or a bulk acoustic wave filter. It is a key component of 5G communication and the only part of the United States that can sanction Huawei phones. There was a time when all Huawei phones only had 4G.

它是BAW滤波器，或体声波滤波器。它是5G通信的关键组件，也是美国唯一可以制裁华为手机的部分。曾经有一段时间，华为所有的手机都只有4G。

Silex Microsystems made a breakthrough in BAW filters and ultimately found the last piece of the puzzle.

Silex Microsystems在BAW滤波器方面取得了突破，最终找到了难题的最后一块。

Designed by Huawei, Silex, and other Chinese companies, manufactured by SMIC International.

由华为、Silex和其他中国公司设计，由中芯国际制造。

The US Department of Commerce must be very disappointed.

美国商务部一定很失望。

I think that’s why Mate 60 Pro suddenly appeared without a press conference or any other event, quietly appearing in Huawei stores and Huawei online stores.

我想这就是为什么Mate 60 Pro在没有新闻发布会或任何其他活动的情况下突然出现的原因，它悄悄地出现在华为商店和华为网店。

The main driver of sanctions against Chinese companies is the US Department of Commerce. Gina Raymond is one of the most radical individuals in the Biden administration to take a stronger stance on China. She is one of the most extreme hawks.

对中国公司实施制裁的主要推动者是美国商务部。吉娜·雷蒙多是拜登政府中对中国采取更强硬立场的最激进的人之一。她是最极端的鹰派之一。

Just as Robert Gates was so convinced that China would not be able to possess stealth fighter jets, China conducted its first test flight of the J-20 during its visit to China in 2011.

就像罗伯特·盖茨如此确信中国将无法拥有隐形战斗机一样，中国在2011年访问中国期间进行了歼20的首次试飞。

It has been 1041 days since Huawei released its last Kirin 9000, and 1566 days since Huawei was listed as a US government entity. With its vast domestic market, China is able to maintain Huawei’s operations.

距离华为发布上一款麒麟9000已经过去了1041天，华为被列入美国政府实体名单至今已有1566天。凭借庞大的国内市场，中国得以维持华为的运营。

The US sanctions Huawei not for its phones, but for its communication devices.

美国制裁华为不是因为它的手机，而是因为它的通讯设备。

The world will choose Huawei to deploy their 5G network, which will be the main technical means to avoid US government surveillance.

世界将选择华为部署他们的5G网络，这将是回避美国政府监视的主要技术手段。

Therefore, even if no backdoors were found, the UK ultimately banned Huawei for security reasons and chose American companies with backdoors in their products.

因此，即使没有发现后门，英国最终出于安全原因禁止了华为，并选择了在其产品中有后门的美国公司。

Britain cannot say no to the United States, because any British politician hopes to stay like a quail under the protection of the United States.

英国不能对美国说不，因为任何英国政治家都希望在美国的庇护下像一只鹌鹑一样呆着。

美国网友丹•米勒的回答

Now all the focus of the world is on chips, is Huawei using chip stacking or implementing revolutionary internal design?

现在世界所有的焦点都集中在芯片上，华为用的是芯片堆叠还是实现了革命性的内部设计？

In fact, Huawei’s true breakthrough is not in chips.

事实上，华为真正的突破并不是芯片。

It’s a filter, Bulk Acoustic Wave Filter is a small component that, in layman’s terms, can achieve different potential speeds on smartphones and provide you with 5G connectivity.

是过滤器，Bulk Acoustic wave Filter（滤波器）是一个小组件，用外行的话说，它可以在智能手机上实现不同的潜在速度，并为您提供5G连接。

Chips are good news, but this is not something remarkable or new. Yes, China can manufacture 5-nanometer chips using foreign DUV devices, which is why the United States has sanctioned these devices. This may be why China now uses stacking to achieve the same processing capacity, but with higher power consumption.

芯片是个好消息，然而，这并不是什么了不起的事，也不是什么新鲜事。是的，中国可以用外国DUV设备制造5纳米芯片，这就是为什么美国制裁了这些设备，这可能就是为什么中国现在使用堆叠来获得相同的处理能力，但功耗更高。

In fact, the BAW filter designed entirely by China is the killer trick here!

事实上，完全由中国设计的BAW滤波器才是这里的杀手绝招！

I bet the commercial cost in China is 60%. Now, China can achieve its entire 5G network spectrum without relying on the West, with complete internal control over raw materials, equipment, design, and processes.

我敢打赌，中国的商业成本是60%，现在，中国可以在不依赖西方的情况下实现其整个5G网络频谱，他们完全在内部控制原材料、设备、设计和工艺。

Perhaps the West will say, ‘They are made with ASML, and we have already restricted the export of ASML, so this will come to an end.’ No one will see China designing and manufacturing 5G BAW filters from scratch and efficiently expanding them, helping China achieve 6G and maintain its lead without relying on the West.

也许西方会说“它们是用ASML制造的，我们已经限制了ASML的出口，所以这将结束”，没有人会看到中国从头开始设计和制造并高效扩展的5G BAW滤波器，帮助中国在不依赖西方的情况下实现6G并保持领先。

This is a major breakthrough made by Huawei, which has concealed this from the world in order to remain undisturbed for the next 2-3 years, while these people are repeatedly focused on chips.

这是华为取得的重大突破，他们对世界隐瞒了这一点，以便在接下来的2-3年里保持不受干扰，而这些人们一次又一次地专注于芯片。

Update: Chinese news media reported that the 12GB/512GB model priced at 7000 yuan was sold out within an hour before its launch. Analysts expect the sales of Mate 60 Pro to exceed 40 million units. This will affect Apple’s expected iPhone sales growth.

更新：中国新闻媒体报道称，售价7000元的12GB/512GB型号在上市前一小时内就销售一空。分析师预计Mate 60 Pro的销量将超过4000万台。这将影响苹果预计的iPhone销量增长。

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